Navi App - Safe to invest in MF & Nasdaq ?

prefer Mfcentral app directly, avoid any third party.

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/pers...

@flash007  @dhinchakrohit  can these third parties run away with invested money like zerodha , groww and Navi ? Is sebi not involved to safe guard the investor ?

Dealcharmer wrote:

@flash007  @dhinchakrohit  can these third parties run away with invested money like zerodha , groww and Navi ? Is sebi not involved to safe guard the investor ?

No they are just intermediaries (kind of broker)

If you want to invest in us stocks I will suggest to give a look at indmoney or kuvera pretty good apps

I'm using indmoney for about 2yrs decent app rest DYOR

Dealcharmer wrote:

@flash007  @dhinchakrohit  can these third parties run away with invested money like zerodha , groww and Navi ? Is sebi not involved to safe guard the investor ?

They cannot run away. But I will never create my Folio with Navi MF as they seem to sell the master data.

You can use. Money invested goes to AMC not to apps. So there won't be any fraud.

@flash007 @dhinchakrohit @Yodaa @LordGane which is the best platform or app for both stocks and mf ?

Dealcharmer wrote:

@flash007 @dhinchakrohit @Yodaa @LordGane which is the best platform or app for both stocks and mf ?

For me, MFU for MF. Can vary as per individual requirements. 

For stocks there's Zerodha, IIFL, Groww, etc.

Dealcharmer wrote:

@flash007 @dhinchakrohit @Yodaa @LordGane which is the best platform or app for both stocks and mf ?

Zerodha is used even by Sucheta Dalal of Moneylife magazine. It's the biggest broker, has good integration with many tax sites so filing returns is easy. Use Quicko. For mutual funds anything is fine. Too much attention is given for apps. Better spend that time to selection of funds instead. Use any app that you like. It makes no difference other than interface. Your money is safe with all those apps. Mfcentral is a no nonsense app for DIY investors. Even Indmoney uses Mfcentral as a backend for some services. 

Yodaa wrote:

No they are just intermediaries (kind of broker)

If you want to invest in us stocks I will suggest to give a look at indmoney or kuvera pretty good apps

I'm using indmoney for about 2yrs decent app rest DYOR

now indmoney etc.have introduced huge charges for us stocks, right?

LordGane wrote:
Zerodha is used even by Sucheta Dalal of Moneylife magazine. It's the biggest broker, has good integration with many tax sites so filing returns is easy. Use Quicko. For mutual funds anything is fine. Too much attention is given for apps. Better spend that time to selection of funds instead. Use any app that you like. It makes no difference other than interface. Your money is safe with all those apps. Mfcentral is a no nonsense app for DIY investors. Even Indmoney uses Mfcentral as a backend for some services. 

paji what do u think about investing in us stocks from tax perspective?is there any good zero fee platform remaining for that?

kukdookoo wrote:
paji what do u think about investing in us stocks from tax perspective?is there any good zero fee platform remaining for that?

Tax compliance is very high for investing in direct US stocks. You will struggle to handle it while filing returns. Indmoney app has some arrangement or websites like vested also offer direct US stocks but with a fee. If you fancy US investments, better use international mutual funds offered by AMC companies like Navi, Icici, MO etc. The taxation is similar to debt mutual funds. Taxation is not complicated through international mutual funds.

LordGane wrote:
Tax compliance is very high for investing in direct US stocks. You will struggle to handle it while filing returns. Indmoney app has some arrangement or websites like vested also offer direct US stocks but with a fee. If you fancy US investments, better use international mutual funds offered by AMC companies like Navi, Icici, MO etc. The taxation is similar to debt mutual funds. Taxation is not complicated through international mutual funds.

havent the changed the taxation rule now?
https://www.financialexpress.com/business/inves...

kukdookoo wrote:
havent the changed the taxation rule now?
https://www.financialexpress.com/business/inves...

Any changes to debt funds will also impact international funds as they both are treated same. What I meant is, if you invest directly in US stocks, your tax compliance increases. You need to disclose your assets and filing returns is MANDATORY. The dividends received will cause further complications. You can't rely on any CA but someone who is particularly good in that field. None of these problems exists with international mutual funds as they are treated on par with debt mutual funds.

kukdookoo wrote:
now indmoney etc.have introduced huge charges for us stocks, right?

I withdraw in July last $5 withdrawal fees for us stock. Conversion sate is still decent

Yodaa wrote:
I withdraw in July last $5 withdrawal fees for us stock. Conversion sate is still decent

Apart from withdrawal fees, now they have started charging comission for every order+amc+transfer fee+some other fees

kukdookoo wrote:
Apart from withdrawal fees, now they have started charging comission for every order+amc+transfer fee+some other fees

Oh that's crazy I withdrew everything before the new tcs law came into effect.

No point sticking to them with so much fees. Kuvera was good too no idea whether they started charging fees too

Yodaa wrote:
Oh that's crazy I withdrew everything before the new tcs law came into effect.

No point sticking to them with so much fees. Kuvera was good too no idea whether they started charging fees too

Kuvera is not charging fee on Indian funds afaik, yet.

kukdookoo wrote:
now indmoney etc.have introduced huge charges for us stocks, right?

@kukdookoo @Yodaa Now the Withdrawal Fees is ZERO and Everything is Free just 0.15% Brokerage! See, the official email from INDMoney to me w.e.f 10th Aug 2023

shraaj wrote:

@kukdookoo @Yodaa Now the Withdrawal Fees is ZERO and Everything is Free just 0.15% Brokerage! See, the official email from INDMoney to me w.e.f 10th Aug 2023

Both INDMoney and Vested now have a 0.15% brokerage fee and 0.75% platform fee.

BlueFlash wrote:

Both INDMoney and Vested now have a 0.15% brokerage fee and 0.75% platform fee.

Platform fee is ZERO in INDMoney!

shraaj wrote:

@kukdookoo @Yodaa Now the Withdrawal Fees is ZERO and Everything is Free just 0.15% Brokerage! See, the official email from INDMoney to me w.e.f 10th Aug 2023

Wait before the end of this quarter, other charges which I have mentioned are also coming up

shraaj wrote:
Platform fee is ZERO in INDMoney!

Writing in bold doesn't makes it zero XD

Just go to app - US stocks - add money - view breakdown - 0.75% platform is clearly being levied.

BlueFlash wrote:

Writing in bold doesn't makes it zero XD

Just go to app - US stocks - add money - view breakdown - 0.75% platform is clearly being levied.

You are right !

Following

Add money has 0.75% platform fee (capped at 1000) which is taken mainly by bank.

0.15% is on any transaction (i.e. twice at buy and at sell).

Example: You invest 1000. This is the min. amount for INDmoney.

0.75% deducted makes it to 992.5. Another 45 GST is charged (min based on slab) making USD equivalent to 947.5 INR is available for trading.

Now you will buy and then sell all equities bought then calculation will come out to:

Now buy and sell charges will apply so 947.5*(1-.0015)^2 = 944.659631875

Worst case - 5.05% is net fee on principal amount itself so better invest small amount via ETFs tracking NASDAQ. Note: Here 4% is taken by Govt.

Story changes to 1% when you invest more than 25k, then the cost comes to 1.2%.

In real world the buy price of USD and sell price of USD also has a delta of 1~3 INR. Obviously you are at loss.

Also note a CA will charge something around 10k for proper ITR filling.

Note there are other charges or restrictions imposed if you do not abide by rules. You can't sell, buy and again sell. One needs to wait for a 3 working days to sell again (some fund settlement rule).

Golden Rules to US equity investing:

1. For max benefit transfer more than 1.33333 lakh in one go when USD to INR is low.
2. If going for less, transfer more than 25k to avoid paying higher GST.
3. If not having 10k to invest then don't invest directly, go via ETFs such as MON100 or Direct MFs
4. Do not invest if you can't handle complications of Taxation.

Refer to https://www.indmoney.com/pricing?type=us-...ks *

*Withdrawal fee is now 0.

abhishekkjain wrote:

Add money has 0.75% platform fee (capped at 1000) which is taken mainly by bank.

0.15% is on any transaction (i.e. twice at buy and at sell).

Example: You invest 1000. This is the min. amount for INDmoney.

0.75% deducted makes it to 992.5. Another 45 GST is charged (min based on slab) making USD equivalent to 947.5 INR is available for trading.

Now you will buy and then sell all equities bought then calculation will come out to:

Now buy and sell charges will apply so 947.5*(1-.0015)^2 = 944.659631875

Worst case - 5.05% is net fee on principal amount itself so better invest small amount via ETFs tracking NASDAQ. Note: Here 4% is taken by Govt.

Story changes to 1% when you invest more than 25k, then the cost comes to 1.2%.

In real world the buy price of USD and sell price of USD also has a delta of 1~3 INR. Obviously you are at loss.

Also note a CA will charge something around 10k for proper ITR filling.

Note there are other charges or restrictions imposed if you do not abide by rules. You can't sell, buy and again sell. One needs to wait for a 3 working days to sell again (some fund settlement rule).

Golden Rules to US equity investing:

1. For max benefit transfer more than 1.33333 lakh in one go when USD to INR is low.
2. If going for less, transfer more than 25k to avoid paying higher GST.
3. If not having 10k to invest then don't invest directly, go via ETFs such as MON100 or Direct MFs
4. Do not invest if you can't handle complications of Taxation.

Refer to https://www.indmoney.com/pricing?type=us-...ks *

*Withdrawal fee is now 0.

Very nicely explained... and yes, investing in US stocks/ETFs makes sense only when you have a decent amount of lumpsum to be done... for SIPs of nominal amount, it's better to go for Interational MFs (slab taxation) or Indian MFs with International exposure (equity taxation)... Also, even when investing directly into US stocks, make sure your use case is of long term investment, and not for trading... else taxes, charges, conversion rates, etc. will not only eat the gain, but also your principal itself... Also, the conversion rate is not that good, with difference b/w buying rate and selling rate being around 5%, so that's a total 10% net expense that needs to be beaten first before getting any actually gain...

BlueFlash wrote:
Very nicely explained... and yes, investing in US stocks/ETFs makes sense only when you have a decent amount of lumpsum to be done... for SIPs of nominal amount, it's better to go for Interational MFs (slab taxation) or Indian MFs with International exposure (equity taxation)... Also, even when investing directly into US stocks, make sure your use case is of long term investment, and not for trading... else taxes, charges, conversion rates, etc. will not only eat the gain, but also your principal itself... Also, the conversion rate is not that good, with difference b/w buying rate and selling rate being around 5%, so that's a total 10% net expense that needs to be beaten first before getting any actually gain...

Can you suggest Nasdaq/NY listed stocks for long term?

except tech stocks like Cloudflare, Amazon, PayPal

Original wrote:

Can you suggest Nasdaq/NY listed stocks for long term?

except tech stocks like Cloudflare, Amazon, PayPal

Being a Boglehead, I only invest in Indexes. For NASDAQ 100 I use QQQ/M and for S&P 500 I use VOO/IVV when investing directly via INDMoney/Vested. And when on the International MFs, I go with ICICI Nasdaq 100 Index MF and Motilal Oswal S&P 500 Index MF.

I lack the expertise of picking individual stocks even in Indian equity XD